magic

Hi all,

I have been making leather products for about 3 years, doing all sorts of various products, and I am mostly focused on fashion items right now. However, I have a passion for guns and leather holsters and I really want to start making some holsters. I have been greeted very kindly by everyone in the holster business, and I truly appreciate how helpful my new friends have been assisting me so far. I have also been lurking around on this site for a little while too, and I have found some great information here thanks to all the contributors.

Where I stand now, is I am trying to figure out what type of machine I need to stitch my holsters on. I have a few machines in my shop, but the work I do now is not quite as heavy as holster work. My "heavy" cylinder arm machine is a Nakajima 380 with a servo motor and speed reducer. It's my go to machine for what I consider heavy work in my shop. Unfortunately, the nakajima sewing thickness is just a tiny bit too small to stitch 2 layers of 7-8 oz leather. It's technically just a medium weight machine. It will do it, but just barely and the stitches are not clean at all. I have only tried it once, and I finished the stitch never to do it again.

I now need to add a couple pieces of equipment to start with the holsters. I need a press to mold on, and I think I can get something for a couple hundred dollars. The only catch is that it will only be big enough to make one holster at a time. I am hoping to find something big enough to mold a few holsters at a time, any recommendations?

The other thing I need is obviously the stitcher. I have been recommended to look at a needle and awl machine like a union lockstitch or a cambell/randall. I am wondering what the "big boys" use to sew holsters. Do they use a needle and awl machine, or just a heavy duty walking foot machine?

Anyone here know what route is the best to go for the press and sewing machine? I appreciate any help here, I am really excited to start making holsters!!!!!! I am getting impatient, I really want to make some holsters already! Help me please!

Jeepin76

Hi magic,
From what I've seen, the Artisan Toro 3000 is the most common holster stitching machine. The COBRA Class 3 seems to be a contender as well. Good luck!

Artisan- http://artisansew.com/

COBRA- http://leathermachineco.com/index.htm

Dwight Cimino

The Tippmann Boss is not for everyone, . . . but I like mine. One of the guys at Sparks also uses one, . . .

If money is a consideration, . . . might want to start there, . . .

May God bless,
Dwight

Rickw

I think it depends on a couple of things. First, how deep are your pockets, and second, what are you, as a craftsman, going to be happy with as far as the stitching is concerned. These are my opinions only, but nothing beats the look and finish of a needle and awl machine....as close to hand stitching as it gets. Don't get me wrong,you can achieve good results with a single needle machine, but for my money,it's needle and awl. I have a Campbell, and it really hurt the pocket book as I purchased it new/rebuilt, but I am, for better or worse, a perfectionist. I've sewn with lots of different machines, from Landis #1's and #3's and #16's, Champions, Singers etc., to Adlers and other single needle rigs (Landis #1 included, as it is a single needle machine also) and the Campbell is where I ended up. Depending on your location, you may be able to find a good used needle and awl machine for a song. Be aware that they require more maintainence then your typical single needle machine, and require a longer learning curve to become proficent with, but I consider it a small price to pay for the results achieved. I also like the fact that most needle and awl machines were designed for the production line, and one in good shape will last a long, long time, and are worth rebuilding if you ever reach that stage. That said, most folks are well served with a single needle machine.
Regards, Rick

http://rickwaltnerholsters.com/

magic

Thanks for the replies on this. I am so glad to have found this forum, it's so hard to find people to discuss this type of issue with in the real world. This place is like a support group for leather addicts, it's great!

I am definitely a perfectionist. I have spent the past few years learning about all sorts of equipment and I have wasted a lot of money buying the wrong equipment to save a little cash. I have learned that it is better to have the proper tools from the beginning to save the hassle of having to sit on a machine I don't need, AND spend all the money to get what I should have got in the first place. From what I have found out in the past few days, the big boys in this business all use the campbell type machine. If that's what I need to make the product the best it can be, I will start looking out for one.

Now what about the press? I can get a small pneumatic forming press with a dwell timer on it relatively inexpensively. It's big enough to do one holster at a time. It's fine if using a short dwell time, but if I want to leave it in there for awhile it would be nice to be able to do more than one at a time. I think this will get me going for now though, but I'm curious to know what I should keep on the lookout for if I want to upgrade to something that can do several holsters at once.

These 2 pieces of equipment are just the tip of the iceberg, I know. I have a lot of work to do here, but this will get me going. I am lucky to have a gentleman who works for us that has experience in holsters, but he did handmade holsters so he doesn't have experience with the machines. What he has helped me with is the process of dyeing, molding, and finishing. With the proper equipment I think we can do some really great work, I can't wait!

thanks so much for the tips folks.

Randyc1974

I started out with the Tippmann Boss stitcher and moved onto the Artisan Toro 3000 and never looked back or had any regrets.
I purchased my holster press from Weaver Leather Company. If you have a federal tax number, Weaver is great to deal with.
I use an oscillating spindle sander for squaring up my edges and my Dremel Tool is often used for the edges. As far as hand tools, it pays to buy the best. I use quality head knifes and utility knifes for cutting out my patterns and quality (Jeremiah Watt) edge bevellers for rounding my edges. Some of my misc. tools are a powered edge burnisher and small tools ie. Sharpie Markers and other smooth utensils for doing my detail boning of the holster after it comes out of the press. As far as working on several holsters at once, be careful with working with black dye on one holster then working on a tan holster at the same time. Several of my tan colored holsters became black colored holsters or dog chew toys after I transferred the black dye from my fingers to the clean tan leather. This is also an issue with the gum rubber pads on your holster press. You don't want to wet press a tan holster with the same side of the pads you used to press a black holster. As far as holster presses, the most power to mold comes from directly under the ram and spreads outwards from the center. Since I only press my holsters for a few minuets, I don't feel the need to press multiple holsters at once. I air dry my holsters, but I'm considering purchasing a convection oven to speed up the drying process.
Best wishes in your endevors!


Randy

magic

Randy,

Thanks for the tips. It never even crossed my mind that I needed different molding rubber for each each color. I've only used mine with black, so I would have screwed up my first natural colored holster for sure. Thanks for the heads up!

As for the press, I had a press available to me, but the gentleman selling it has completely dropped off the face of the earth, can't get hold of him at all. So now I am thinking about a shop press from harbor freight. They have an air operated press for a few hundred dollars, do you think I could get by with this? I think its 25 ton, but I'd have to check and I'm posting from my phone so I can't easily look now.

Next question, I have come across a sewing machine I am interested in. Its a shoe machine, but looks like it might work. Its a Champion Mckay 77. It looks like a chainstitch, but I was told by the cobbler it is a lockstitch. I also have a cambell/randall that I might be able to buy, but the Mckay is easier to get and probably cheaper. Anyone know what the champion mckay 77 is, and if it will work for stitching my holsters?


Thanks again!

Rickw

The only McKay I have any experience with was a Sutton, and it was a chain stitch. Can't say with certainty what the Champion is, but I can tell you that I think you would be better off with the Campbell.
Regards, Rick