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Old 07-18-2002, 02:52 AM   #1
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Full length dust cover rule

At the last IDPA match I shot a fellow shooter was using a full length dustcover CZ .45 ACP.

Not being a Range Rat I didn't ask, but has IDPA changed the ruling on full length dust cover guns?

Thanks-

Brent
 
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Old 07-18-2002, 09:59 AM   #2
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The CZ 97B is a DA/SA pistol in .45 that comes from the factory with a full dust cover. Since it is a DA/SA pistol it could be used in SSP where basically only factory offered pistols with no external modifications, can be used. There is a note at the end of the section in guidelines for CDP equipment that says:

Pistols approved for SSP may also be used in ESP or CDP depending on caliber.

If the pistol, and its a big one, fits in the box, meets the guidelines for SSP, it can be shot in either division.

That's my take on it.
 
Old 07-18-2002, 11:02 AM   #3
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I think Brent is referring to the "NON-INCLUSIVE list of EXCLUDED modifications," which specifically mentions "extended dust covers."

I read it the same way, Brent, that extended dust covers, like the Baer Monolith and Springer Operator, are not allowed. Like you, I wouldn't have squawked, either.

In the IDPA column in the latest Combat Handguns, I thought it ironic they had a glowing review of the Caspian Recon Frame 1911, a weapon specifically disallowed from IDPA becuase of the full length dust cover AND the coned barrel.

Scott
 
Old 07-18-2002, 11:36 AM   #4
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Thanks for the reply guys.

I was referring to the list in which full length-dust covers are mentioned.

Scott, I caught that too and thought it odd (the magazine article).

Anyway, my end goal is the hope that my SV might be legal now, but I doubt anything has changed.

John, if I could get 10 round single stack 10mm mags I wouldn't care!

Anyway, maybe someday they'll change the rule. I don't really think the full length makes much difference, but it looks cool. I definetly don't see it starting an IDPA equipment race if they were legal, but its not a rule I'm going to worry much about- just curious.

Brent
 
Old 07-18-2002, 05:55 PM   #5
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In the case of the 97B, the full-length dustcover is not a "modification," and I think that's the important point. With the other guns you see mentioned, you're usually referring to a full-blown custom gun, and not something off the assembly line (ala CZ, EAA, etc.) A SIG P-210 has a full-length dustcover, and its legal.

The list of things not allowed generally refer to after-market changes to the gun, or all the knick-knacks that can be added to a custom 1911.

(I said "generally", 'cause things like bull barrels, even when from the factory, aren't allowed. Question: is a bull barrel available from Wilson Custom?)
 
Old 07-19-2002, 03:32 AM   #6
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The dust cover on the 97B is as much of a modification as the full length dust cover on my Strayer-Voight- by that I mean the original CZ didn't have one, nor did the original 1911.

The CZ is being marketed as a competition gun (I have an add for it right next to me), they recognize it as a "modification" of the original design.

Yes, it left the factory that way- but so did any 1911 with a full length dust cover.

Just a thought.

Brent
 
Old 07-19-2002, 03:56 AM   #7
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If someone showed up at my IDPA match with a CZ with the extended dustcover like the "Standard IPSC" one http://www.czub.cz/obsah/images/CZ75IP-m.jpg I would tell him he has an illegal gun, but feel free to shoot.

I would post his score, but not in ESP or CDP. In his own class. This is something we do for those who dont own IDPA legal guns but who want to compete. We also do this for those who dont want to shoot stages the IDPA way, more the "IPSC" way I guess you could say.
 
Old 07-19-2002, 06:53 AM   #8
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I asked around before I made the reply I did. The CZ 97B is legal with respect to SSP and therefore it would be legal in CDP in 8+1.

The CZ Standard IPSC is a modified CZ 75, SA only, and that's why they are saying no go.

I ain't goin' there with respect to why long dust covers are not legal.

Brent, I emailed metalform about the 10rd 10mm mags. I told them that I used their 9rd mags and what I did to make them run in my Caspian and that the mags had to fit in "The Box". Their reply was "Thank you for your note. We are developing a 10-round 40SW/10mm magazine and I appreciate your input. It is still a few months away from prototype so please be patient. We will post on our web site when they become available." We just may get there yet.
 
Old 07-19-2002, 07:49 AM   #9
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"In the case of the 97B, the full-length dustcover is not a "modification," and I think that's the important point. "

The Springer Operator is not a modification. It is a factory gun, and specifically disallowed, so I'm not sure why the 97B would be any different.

But then, no cone barrels, 10mm in ESP, no knee-pads...who knows what some of the rules are based on. Could this ruling be linked to the fact that Wilson does not offer a fulll dust cover gun? No, that would be cynical thinking.

Scott
 
Old 07-19-2002, 10:05 AM   #10
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It will be interesting to see what develops as more and more full length dust cover guns come onto the market.

John, thanks for the magazine update. This is indeed good news for both shooters forced to shoot the 10mm in ESP IDPA and those who use their single stack 10/40's for IPSC L10.

Brent
 
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