Alabaster

I'd put my foot down now. Really, Kahr should be willing to stand behind their stuff. If they can't get it right(Assuming you haven't voided factory warranty), then you deserve to get what you paid for. A working firearm. You use this thing to carry. Or, at least you would if it worked, right? I'd imagine they couldn't let that go knowing people's lives are at stake if that gun malfunctions and they knew about it. Everyone makes mistakes, but it's okay if you right them. They should do the same.

This is another reason why I encourage people to do business with Davidson's. If you are not going to customize or otherwise void the factory coverage, they will honor their own "LIFETIME REPLACEMENT" guarantee. I've used it once on a customer's 1911, and it honestly was even easier than Davidson's had made it out to be.

Sorry, back on topic. Have you thought of contacting C&S or another large outfit that works on Kahrs?

captbahbah

Replacing the firearm is not out of the question. I haven't insisted because it's such a magilla to do all the paperwork over again for the replacement.
I got the gun back this past Thursday, 12/29/11. I put a hundred rounds of Speer Lawman, 250 grain ball through the gun. Here's what happened. I fired 5 shot strings from 21 feet. On the first box, after the 1st string of fire, the inertia of my combat reload forced the slide to go forward which caused a failure to feed malfunction. I cleared it and continued shooting. On the 9th string, the same malfunction occurred. Throughout the strings, inertia did not always cause the slide to go forward. The times that it did, a round was chambered (like it's supposed to). I fired the 2nd box of 50 from 10 feet, rapid fire, 5 shot strings. No malfunctions occurred. When inertia did force the slide to go forward, a round was chambered. The testing continues.....

handgunnut

Wow, well I personally get very attached to any hand gun i purchase. My guns are like my children. Sure occasionally I trade guns with friends dont get me wrong but my kahr k9 won't get rid of it ever.. well won't get rid of my John deeds green and yellow Riyadh p89 either.. but i wont get into why with that now. I do like my kahr but hate the factory sights. But will admit I am probably aiming wrong with it but reguardless its grouping is remarkable and super close together at 25ft. Just not where I am aiming for or where i think i am aiming at least. Don't know what to say.. I am sure kahr will make it right.

captbahbah

Tuesday 1/10/12. Ran 50 rounds of Federal 230 grain ball through the gun. No malfuntions.
During combat reloads, inertia did not always cause the slide to go forward. When it did, a round
was chambered. Joy, joy.

spentcase

I and others really appreciate your follow up posts Sir.

I have two Kahrs, a PM9 and an MK9 Elite 2000, and am now shopping for another pistol. I hadn't considered a .45 (am looking at .40's), but your experience with Kahr's customer service, which is usually reported to be pretty good (and in my own experience has been), is something that does not depend on a caliber. I've been on the fence between an MK40 Elite and a Glock 27. While your experience will not necessarily sway my decision, it is something to consider. Thank you!

sc

edit: fwiw, In all the rounds I've put through my Kahr's in the last ten years I've only experienced one failure to feed and I'm certain that was my fault. They have both been flawless in function. I sincerely hope your troubles are behind you. I think the vast majority of Kahr owners are very happy with their purchase. I hope you will be as well in the long run.

oso 1964

captbahbah, i would demand a new pistol already. i have a pm45 the 3rd. time was the charm, the 3rd. time the pistol was replaced. the 1st. pm45 had every malfunction,FTF,FTE mags falling out of pistol,cracked mags. Davidsons replaced the pistol.
pistol #2 still had problems not as mant as 1st. i took took it back to dealer, he talked to rep a davidsons they sent it back to kahr, when i got the pistol back had the same issues as before it went back to kahr. called dealer, he talked to davidsons again, a davidsons rep called me. he left option up to me,either send it back to kahr or he would replace the pistol again. i took another replacement pistol.
pm45 #3 this pistol has performed flawlessly. 600 rds. through 3rd. pistol no problems of ant kind. now from the 1st. to 2nd. and 3rd. pistol kahr has made changes to the design, i took every possible mesurement, there was a lot of changes enough that it led me to believe kahr new they had design issues. that is why they replaced you barrel and slide. the changed barrel legnth, made new cuts in slide.

captbahbah

oso 1964, Glad to hear you ended up with one that works. I intend to do the same. I have pm45 fatigue right now. Have to psych myself up for the B.S with paper work shuffle that will be involved. I've since gone back to my S&W 649 Bodyguard(old .38spl.) with 4 speed loaders and 2x2x2 ammo pouch.
spentcase, I really liked those PM9's. Tested them for my department when I was an instructor. Recommended them to people retiring. I had an MK40. Never had a problem with reliability. Had to exchange magazines, though, because the first batch I bought with the gun, the top round kept working out of the mag. After getting new mags, no problem. Traded that MK40 to buy the pm45. Wish they'd made an MK45.

oso 1964

i know exactly how you feel i went through everthing you did. the only reason i stuck it out was because the pistol is so compact and comfortable to carry,also it is very accurate. i bought it to be my concealed carry gun,but like you had no confidence in its reliabilty until the 3rd. pistol. it is worth the paper work,each time i had the pistol replaced i had to fill out new paper work but in the end it was worth it. after my expierence with the pm45, every firearm i buy i go through a dealer who uses davidsons as his distributer. it is easier to deal with davidsons than the manufacturers,any manufacturer.

captbahbah

I'm going to stick with the gun for those same reasons. It is accurate as heck, isn't it? When I get around to it, I'll do the paperwork. Thanks.

captbahbah

Thursday. March 15, 2012. Brought my pm45 to my range to have it shipped back to Kahr. Had several range sessions since last post. When the gun worked, it was accurate as usual. Unfortunately, failure to feed too often. Was wasting too much money for ammo on a gun that wasn't working right! Will update on new gun.

retDAC

Thanks for the update.

captbahbah

Kahr shipped my gun back ( second time ) to the Westside range last Thursday or Friday. The first time, they shipped me a new gun but without my XS 24/7 Big Dot sights. Had to ship it back. Tonight, July 13, 2012 at approximately 1920 hrs, I shot 190 rounds out of the gun. A range buddy shot 10 rounds and another range buddy shot five rounds for a total of 205 rounds. Ammo was 100 rounds of Federal 230 grain FMJ and 100 rounds of Remmington UMC 230 grain JHP and 5 rounds of Lawman 230 grain ball. In all, 2 failures to eject occurred; probably shooter induced, 1 failure to feed occurred with JHP but the guy insisted that it was not shooter induced; once, the slide locked back during firing; probably my thumb hit the slide lock and 1 empty shell casings hit my right eyebrow 1 empty shell casing hit my forehead. I shot 5 shot strings with RH, LH, BH; slow fire at 50 ft and rapid fire at 21 feet. Experienced no malfunctions during rapid fire. Gun is accurate as heck. A good start. Had to leave the gun at the range. Still waiting approval of my purchase order. Will update.

captbahbah

Took possession of the new pm45 yesterday, July 23. Shot 100 rounds of 230 grain ball Winchester white box. Gun did not like the ammo. Had 15 failures to eject. The shell casings were caught in the ejection port as the slide was returning to battery. I then shot 50 rounds of 230 grain TMJ Lawman. Only one failure to eject. The owner of the range shot 50 rounds of Lawman and he experienced one failure to eject. I also shot 19 rounds of 230 grain Winchester Rangers and experienced 3 failures to eject. Not looking so good.

captbahbah

July 30, 2012. Back to the range. Shot 50 rounds of Remington 230 grain JHP. 2 failures to eject. Shot 50 rounds of Federal 230 grain FMJ. 1 failure to eject. Went back to the Winchester 230 grain FMJ. Shot 46 rounds of that. The gun liked that the least. 4 failures to eject. The saga continues.

retDAC

Thanks.

captbahbah

Friday, August 17, 2012. Fired 100 rounds of Federal 230 grain FMJ. Majority of strings of fire done at 21 feet with BH. A string of 5 shots with RH only at 50 feet. Experienced 1 failure to eject during slow fire with RH. Most likely due to my grip. 1 failure to feed during 1 shot drills from holster. The slide locked back with rounds in the magazine. TRR but a round did not chamber. Repeated TRR and then it fired. Overall, I felt pretty good about the gun today. More to come.

KainThornn

That's some dedication! I hope this all gets solidly resolved soon, you've waited long enough. I'm reminded of that scene from Tommy Boy where Tommy is talking about "...if you put a warranty on a lump of sh*t, it's just a warranteed lump of sh*t..." Stellar reputations aside, if you're the unlucky recipient of that one in ten thousand bad unit, they should accept their boo boo and rectify...

captbahbah

Kain. Everyone's been saying the same thing to me. The new gun is better than the old gun right off the bat. In the age of Glocks and custom 1911's we forget that the semi-auto is ammo sensitive. Even Glocks have their lemons, I'm sure. The first gun was definitely a lemon. Hope this one is not a lump of sh*t. I really like the gun. Will update.

captbahbah

Shot 250 rounds of Remington UMC, 230 grain FMJ on Sunday. Experienced 5 failures to feed, 5 failures to extract. The slide locked open with rounds in the magazine several times. At the end of the range session I discovered that the front of the guide rod came off!! What the heck?

captbahbah

Thursday, August 30, 2012. New recoil spring and guide rod assembly delivered today. Wrong one! They sent one for the full size model and not the pm model. Happened with my first gun also. Incompetence! No other reason. Especially after I emphatically reminded the technician that I needed one for the pm and not the full size. Breathe deeply; in through the nose, out through the nose.....

retDAC

Your perseverence is admirable.

captbahbah

Update. A second recoil spring & guide rod assembly shipped to me last week. It is two coils longer than the first one. Called Kahr. Young woman asnswers phone; the same one I spoke with last time I called. Told her my problem. She put me on hold. Came back on the line and said I could clip off the extra coils. I asked for another assembly. New one arrived today. This one is just a bit shorter than spring #2 but longer than spring #1. It's gotta be me. After trying several times, I got spring #1 into slide. Then repeated with spring #3. Didn't bother with #2. I've never experienced such difficulty putting in spring/guide rod. Feeling very incompetent right about now.

captbahbah

Was able to get in 65 rounds ( it's all I had with me ) of Federal 230 grain ball during down time at work. Happy to report there were no malfunctions with my pm45. No erratic ejection but for two shell casings that hit my forehead (which is how this whole thing started).

captbahbah

Shot 50 rounds of the usual out of the pm45. 7 failures to eject. Also, realized that the round does not clear the chamber/ejection port during administrative unload. Stood in front of a mirror and observed nose of the round impacting the outer edge of the chamber and ejection port. Going to ship it out to Karl Sokol.

captbahbah

Spoke with Karl Sokol last Thursday. He has my pm45 (did not clean from last session), the 7 shell casings that failed to eject, a handful of shell casings that did eject and my journal, detailing everything I've been through with the 1st and 2nd pistol. Upon his initial assessment, he thinks the problem may be the ejector. Let's see if he can work his magic.

captbahbah

Got my pm45 back from Karl Sokol today. He shortened the ejector, fired 150 rounds of 230 grain ball out of it and reported that he experienced no malfunctions. He took his time with it. He also textured the left side of the receiver for my left thumb placement. I put 50 rounds of Federal 230 grain ball through it tonight and had the shell casing of the 25th round hit my forehead above my right eyebrow. The 50th round failed to feed. Not the start I was hoping for but the gun sure felt good in my hands when I was shooting it. That 25th shell casing was one of a 5 shot string with my right hand only. The 50th, was a 5 shot string with both hands rapid fire. I'm going to say it may have been operator error. Let's see what happens......

captbahbah

Since my last post I put another 150 rounds of Speer Lawman 230 grn TMJ through the gun. A range buddy ran 50 rounds of the same but he didn't handle the gun well at all and experienced a stove pipe, 2 failures to feed and had 7 shell casings hit his forehead. Me, of the 150, I had 2 failures to feed and a shell casing cut me right in the middle of my forehead. 250 rounds since I got it back from Karl Sokol. I'll give it another 250.

retDAC

Have you emailed Sokol about any of this?

captbahbah

Yes. Spoke with him over the phone. His response was that with the small semi-autos, you can't let up on the grip at all. So, I'm going to give it another 250 rounds. If I'm unhappy with the malfunction/reliability ratio, I'll get rid of the gun. So far street ammo have been reliable, especially Speer Gold Dot. I'm obviously going to have to spend more money just to run street ammo through the gun as well. Also, for a personal protection firearm, I don't need it to be so sensitive. In the age of Glocks, and tuned 1911s we tend to forget that semi autos are dirt sensitive and ammunition sensitive. I feel I'm just fine with my S&W 649 with Speer Gold Dot .38 special. I just want the bigger bullet.

captbahbah

You're not going to believe this. I was just getting my range bag together for tomorrow. I gathered my street ammo: Speer Gold Dot, Federal Premium and Golden Saber. Just for the heck of it, I chambered a dummy round into the chamber. The dummy is a Federal shell casing with a hollow point. The dummy round is stuck, the slide is out of battery. Now I have to wait until I'm at the range to see if someone there can get the round out of the chamber. Very frustrated right now.

retDAC

I can certainly believe the problem with small locked breech semis in 9x19 and up.

As to the stuck dummy round, don't you have something with which to punch it out?

captbahbah

Used screwdriver to wedge breech face and chamber. That loosened it enough to rack the slide.

captbahbah

Shot 87 rounds of assorted street ammo: Gold Dot, Golden Saber, Federal Premium. All 230 grain JHP. Had 1 failure to feed, 2 failures to eject, the slide wouldn't return to battery twice while shooting, 3 shell casings hit my forehead, 2 shell casings got stuck in the chamber/ejection port. No malfunction occurred because on both occasions, they were the last rounds fired in the string of fire. Not going to waste any more time, money or ammo. I'm done. Cleaned the gun and put it away. Going put it toward a trade-in for a Glock 39. I shot 100 rounds through the G39 and it was a really good shooter. No malfunctions. Good luck to all PM45 owners. It's been real.

retDAC

You hung in there far longer than I would have. Truly have appreciated all the reports & updates. Better luck with the next.

Dan983

I purchased a CW 45 and absolutely love it. I recently bought a new CW 9mm and am having a problem on the last shot it clambering the round but leaving the pistol uncocked? Too bad as I have to send it back to the factory for repair!