|08-25-2002, 10:08 AM||#1|
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Happy Valley, UT
Kahr PM9 Range Report and Kahr Complaint
Had a chance to shoot my new Kahr PM9 briefly last week for the first time. I got it with factory-installed Meprolight Tru Dot night sights.
As usual, the Federal 9BP 115gr JHP (standard pressure) was the most accurate and precise of all loads tested.
In 300 rounds, there were no failures to feed, fire or extract.
The trigger is very good, IMNSHO, for a small CCW defense gun.
Like all Kahrs, it has a relatively long but smooth pull, and a correspondingly long reset, but these are not at all problematic to me in a defensive gun.
The standard magazine holds 6 rounds, and the extended floorplate mag (the gun comes with one of each) holds 7.
There were no functioning problems with the magazines.
This is also the first of four Kahrs I've owned that had the sights correctly regulated, that is, point of impact coinciing with point of aim. (Each of the others has required the rear sight to be drifted slightly left.)
Other rounds tried this first time out included only NATO surplus 124gr FMJ, Cor-Bon 124gr+P JHP, and Sellier & Bellot 115gr FMJ, so it's not a very broad sampling, and I'll have to try the Federal 9BPLE 115gr +P+ JHP, Pro Load 124gr +P JHP, and Remington Golden Saber 124gr +P JHP next time.
The tested rounds were all acceptably accurate, tested at 7 yards, that is, all were in the 1 1/2" bullseye, though the Federal 9BP made "one hole groups", while the others did not.
I don't own a chronograph, so can't comment on velocities.
Fit and finish are on par with my P9, that is, just fine. The slide is the standard matte stainless steel, with an even finish and no visible tool marks.
I don't think Kahr's polymer technology is quite up to Glock's yet, and rumor has it that the same outfit that makes Ruger's polymer frames also makes Kahr's, and they do look to be similar. Nonetheless, the frame has no defects, and hasn't broken, warped or changed fit in my brief exposure to it, and it makes the little dingus VERY lightweight to carry.
Compared to my Kahr MK9, it seems MUCH lighter in a pocket holster (Null and Action-Direct tried) or ankle rig (Null and Renegade tried), and even holding 7 rounds of 115gr 9mm JHP, it's lighter in the hand and in the pocket than my S&W J-frame Centennial 642 loaded with five rounds of Federal 158gr LSWCHP.
I like it.
Kahr is obviously having some QC problems lately, judging by my own experience* and that of others as posted on several gun-related Internet BBs, so take a critical look at gun fit and finish before you accept delivery on one of these little Moonie guns, but this particular model certainly fills a CCW niche for a lightweight "full power" (i.e, non-mousegun caliber) pistol well.
* I've sent a NIB Kahr MK9 Elite98 back to Kahr TWICE so far, for problems including stripped grip screw holes, ill-fitting grips, and a poor trigger, and each time I've had difficulty contacting Kahr and receiving the gun back in a reasonable time frame. I'm still waiting, currently at one month after the more recent send-back, two months the first time.
Nobody at Kahr will answer emails, and I've sent them to the "higher-ups" in the company as well as to the proletariat.
Long distance phone calls at my expense (six so far) result in being put on "hold" interminably, and often speaking to someone who eventually proves that they can't help, and who obviously speaks English as a second language (mentioned because they had difficulty understanding and communicating), as well as being told that "no one else was available" to help, and even when a return call from someone who CAN help is requested, I've only actually gotten a single call-back, with resultant promises but (so far) no results.
Kahr owes me (and every customer) better service in dealing with a repair-replacement issue for a gun with a MSRP of nearly $700!
They need to get their quality control and personnel problems fixed PRONTO if they expect to remain viable in today's marketplace, instead of adopting the "ignore 'em and they'll go away" approach.
Why have email contact information available if you won't respond to customers?
Why advertise a "lifetime warranty" if it takes multiple efforts and prolonged wait times on the part of customers to receive proper and satisfactory service?
Guess I'll add this missive, FWIW, to the long list of emails I've already sent to Kahr, and will be posting it on several other BBs as well. Any followup I get will be posted, as well.
|08-25-2002, 12:18 PM||#2|
Join Date: Jun 2001
Good report, 'Bones.
As you may know, I am a promotor of Kahr products, I think they have some very good stuff going.
On the other hand, bad customer service and poor communications are unforgiveable. What little comm I've had with them got decent responses, and for the most part, what I hear does not reflect your experience, however...... if enough people get that treatment, it doesn't matter how good the product is. I'm fighting Isuzu right now because of several minor problems over which they have turned their back on me. If they had made even a half-assed attempt to do the right thing it might have been OK.... if they had said, You're just too picky, you're a problem customer, beat it, that would have been fair.... but they have ignored me. OOOooh I hate that! They have made an enemy of me now, and I'm going WAY out of my way to make them do the right thing. In the end they will have to acknowledge my existance!
|08-25-2002, 06:53 PM||#3|
Join Date: Aug 2002
Sawbones,thanx for your "report". I will be waiting to hear about the next "chapter" in your hassles with Kahr. I just read your post and am now thinking of going for an alternative to Kahr. I get the paranoid feeling that quality control and service in the US has been deteriorating faster in the last couple years.
|08-28-2002, 03:04 PM||#4|
Join Date: Jan 2002
Thank you for the report. It makes me hopeful that my PM9 will eventually perform at the level I require. I have fired about 300 rounds and still have 1-2 failures per 50 rounds. Today it was one failure to feed (Rem GS 124 jammed against feed ramp) and one failure to eject (Fed P9HS3G case caught between standing breech and barrel hood). Failures have occured with Rem GS 124 std and +P, Fed 9BPLE, and Fed P9HS3G (124 HS +P+). I can't put my finger on it, but when working the slide the gun does not feel as smooth as my P9 or MK9, both of which have performed flawlessly for several years. The PM9 has been detail stripped, cleaned and lubed, but I can't find any obviously roughness, burrs, etc. Right now I am trying to decide whether to send it to Kahr or to a custom gunsmith. Aside from the reliability ( :evil: ), the gun is a pleasure to carry and shoot and I really want to fix the reliability problem(s).
|09-13-2002, 08:21 PM||#5|
Join Date: Sep 2002
Another PM9 review
I also have a new PM9.
Very well-built, tight, and accurate. Mine has the nite-sites.
In the first 350 rounds I have had no problems. I have used 115, 124, 147, rnd nose, flat nose and hollow points. Also Blazer aluminum cased. Not a single malfunction. I am completely satisfied thus far. I hope it has the long term durability.
Even though i said "no malfunctions", I did notice an idiosyncracy that I don't feel is a flaw:
If I chamber the first round by depressing the slide lock, it is 100% reliable.
If I try to "slingshot" the slide on the first round, it will often not feed. The bullet nose pushes into the ramp but doesn't slide up into full battery. This occurred even after polishing the feedramp.
In analyzing the problem, and noticing that the slide-lock-depression-method was 100% reliable, I noticed that when slingshotting, the isometric tension between the weak arm and the strong arm causes the pistol to jerk forward and downward slightly when the slide is released. This reduces the effective momentum force of the slide to strip and chamber the top round. This effect is greatly exagerrated on the PM9 because of it incredaibly light weight. If you are VERY careful to hold the stroing hand RIGID when slingshotting, it will work properly. My solution is simply to make a habit of always using the slide release lever instead.
Kahr has completely ignored my emails also. :evil:
|09-14-2002, 09:00 PM||#6|
Join Date: Sep 2002
I put another 100 rounds through my PM9 today. 124 gr Speer Gold Dot Hollow Points.
Again, 100% reliable. I was trying to empty the clips as fast as I could pull the trigger, and it was surprising how well i could stay on target. The accuracy was extremely good for such a small pistol (and my general marksmanship ability). Coffee cups and coke cans (end on) were easy to hit on the first shot at about 20 yards.
I noted that even slingshotting the slide on the first round worked every time now that I am being conscious of getting a very clean snap and holding my hand rigid.
Since the pistols seems to be everything it claims, i will only report back if something unusual happens.
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