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Old 02-22-2005, 05:44 AM   #1
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Charter Arms 9MM Federal

Anybody have any load data on 9MM Federal. These are kind of scarce and are used in a Charter Arms Pit Bull ?


regards....roger
 
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Old 02-26-2005, 08:22 PM   #2
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9mmFederal

At the risk of being the butt of a joke, I will be the straight man for this inquiry.
9mm is the approximate caliber of several cartridges-9x19 Luger or parabellum being the most common (others include 9x18 Makarov, 9mm kurz(.380 ACP), and 9mmLargo). Federal is a manufacturer of ammunition.
Charter Arms made a Bull Dog in .44 spec.
Whats the punch line?
Regards, Walter B
 
Old 02-27-2005, 12:46 AM   #3
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The 9mm Federal was so short lived that is is unlikely any reloading data was generated by anyone.

Still, it was a rimmed version of the 9mm Luger, so that data may (repeat - may) be usable. Proceed with due caution of you elect to pursue this. You might compare case volumes to begin with and try to find out what the operating pressure was, compared to the 9mm Luger.

Shoot
 
Old 02-27-2005, 04:10 AM   #4
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Re: 9mmFederal

Quote:
Originally Posted by WalterB
At the risk of being the butt of a joke, I will be the straight man for this inquiry.
9mm is the approximate caliber of several cartridges-9x19 Luger or parabellum being the most common (others include 9x18 Makarov, 9mm kurz(.380 ACP), and 9mmLargo). Federal is a manufacturer of ammunition.
Charter Arms made a Bull Dog in .44 spec.
Whats the punch line?
Regards, Walter B
No punch line Walter :wink:

Charter Arms made a model called the Pit Bull and it was chambered in 9MM Federal (long since discontinued). Federal being a designation and not a manufacturer. As we have later learned, while similar to the other 9MM, it is different. My brother likes picking up these odd pieces (since he is also odd :roll: ) but when he saw the lack of ammo out there he decided to get back into reloading after 30 years !! I've told him to be careful and not to do it when anybody is home.

regards....roger
 
Old 02-27-2005, 08:34 AM   #5
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Federal IS a manufacturer, not a "designation." They were the only makers of 9mm Federal ammunition.
I guess the marketing people thought it would be better to name the cartridge after the ammo company instead of the gun company.

At the risk of, in Jeff Cooper's words, contributing to the delinquency of a handloader, I will quote from Hal Swiggett in the 1990 Gun Digest.

"Federal lists their 9mm Luger load at 1160 fps from the muzzle. The 9mm Federal is listed at 1280 fps. Although the barrel at 2 1/2 inches is shorter in the revolver, velocity is upped by 120 fps. A call to Federal revealed the same powder is used in both cartridges, but there's a little more in the rimmed version."

I would NOT take that as a license to hotload the Charter Arms, but would have no problem loading 9mm F with starting loads for 9mm P. Why go above that? It's a curio, not a gunfighting weapon, I hope.

Swiggett also said:

"Five regular 115 grain 9mm Luger cartridges were slipped into those cylinder chambers and every one fired every time, but it took a ballpoint pen to punch out the empties. They printed right along with the rimmed version as did Federal 9mm Luger Match."

Y'all be careful, now, you hear?
 
Old 02-28-2005, 06:09 PM   #6
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No punchline

rewster,
I'm glad I asked the question. It seemed to bring a few of the more knowledgeable members into the discussion and I learned something.
I don't know if I will ever see a fire arm chambered for this cartridge, but if I do, Iwill know what it is.
Thanks, WalterB
 
Old 03-01-2005, 04:34 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Watson
Federal IS a manufacturer, not a "designation." They were the only makers of 9mm Federal ammunition.
I guess the marketing people thought it would be better to name the cartridge after the ammo company instead of the gun company.

At the risk of, in Jeff Cooper's words, contributing to the delinquency of a handloader, I will quote from Hal Swiggett in the 1990 Gun Digest.

"Federal lists their 9mm Luger load at 1160 fps from the muzzle. The 9mm Federal is listed at 1280 fps. Although the barrel at 2 1/2 inches is shorter in the revolver, velocity is upped by 120 fps. A call to Federal revealed the same powder is used in both cartridges, but there's a little more in the rimmed version."

I would NOT take that as a license to hotload the Charter Arms, but would have no problem loading 9mm F with starting loads for 9mm P. Why go above that? It's a curio, not a gunfighting weapon, I hope.

Swiggett also said:

"Five regular 115 grain 9mm Luger cartridges were slipped into those cylinder chambers and every one fired every time, but it took a ballpoint pen to punch out the empties. They printed right along with the rimmed version as did Federal 9mm Luger Match."

Y'all be careful, now, you hear?
Thanks for the additional info Jim. Great name Watson ! Mine's the same. Don't know of any relatives in the South. I have passed the info on to my brother with the cautions. It's good to see another pack rat that keeps all the old books. All my reloading info is current since I only got into this last year.

I might take minor exception to 9mm "Federal" not being a "designation". I wasn't aware that it was as short lived as it turned out to be and that Federal was the only mfg. However, while Winchester is a mfg. wouldn't it also be a designation as in .243 Winchester or .308 Winchester. Or maybe .223 Remington. There are a lot of mfg. of both.

Now I'm onto something new for a friend. Loading data for .38 / .38 Super and .357 mag. He has several cans of WAP-3 which has been discontinued for some time and can't find any load data. I'm going to post a new topic. Any help would be appreciated.

Best regards....Roger E. Watson (Rhode Island)
 
Old 08-22-2005, 03:41 PM   #8
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Any interest in these weapons or the ammo still? I'm posting both with accessories on gunsamerica.com this evening. I've got 240 or so rounds of Federal 147gr. JHP left after I took the revolver, ammo, speed loaders, etc. in trade for a Philips & Rodgers Model 47 Medusa a little while back. For some reason I'm thinking the original factory ammo is actually marked "+P," but I haven't looked at it in a while.
-RHM
 
Old 08-22-2005, 04:42 PM   #9
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Here's some more info:

http://www.gunsandammomag.com/values/march_0624/

John
 
Old 01-11-2006, 08:59 AM   #10
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As the .45 Autorim was developed as a means of shooting without moonclips, Have you tried using standard 9mm with moonclips ? There are 5 and six shot 9mm moon clips out there not sure if chamber would line up, but they are cheap and might work
 
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