What's the 9x23 Nowlin compared to the 9x23 Winchester? - Pistolsmith
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Old 03-15-2004, 06:20 PM   #1
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 260
What's the 9x23 Nowlin compared to the 9x23 Winchester?

I note our good host mentions the Nowlin reamer in his own writings and I gather prefers others. I don't know what that tells me about the 9X23 Nowlin but I now have RCBS carbide sizing dies so marked - I also have RCBS carbide dies marked for 9x23 Winchester.

Any history information or comments?
 
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Old 03-16-2004, 07:23 AM   #2
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 223
I don't know if this will help but.....
A while back I ordered a nowlin drop in Bar. for my 1991a1 in .38 super to shoot 9x23. It fit perfectly and has fed 9x23 winchester(both loads) and my reloads usuing starline brass perfectly so far. I think it may be another name for the same animal.
 
Old 03-16-2004, 07:55 AM   #3
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 260
I believe it to be the same but I don't know

I have the impression such dies were made by RCBS to be resold by Nowlin along with other 9x23 items - I know Nowlin lists dies and other sources refer to Nowlin as a source for dies.

As noted our good host says in his most valuable discussion that the Nowlin design reamer is not necessarily the best possible, I understand especially the throating but I may well misunderstand.

I'll know eventually but I have not reloaded extensively since I gave up gallery pistol - no good at it and didn't want to use an optical sight anyway. I used to have dies for about all pistol calibers and I would mix and match sizing and expander dies for different brass especially but also different chambers and bullets.
 
 
Old 03-16-2004, 08:25 AM   #4
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 223
I don't have any specific 9x23 dies I have been usuing 9mm dies with a 223 shellholder. I know alot of guys have had luck with a 9x23 sizer and then 9mm dies but I took danes advice and just used my 9mm dies.
I've got no idea on the throat issue. Maybe Dane will help us out.
I do know I've had no pressure issues so far and I've run some pretty stout loads.
Eric
 
Old 03-25-2004, 07:01 AM   #5
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 500
I am getting confused here. Are we talking about 3 different issues?
1. Reloading Dies
2. Chamber sizes
3. different cases.

With regards to reloading dies, the ring on a reloading die is just that, is a doughnut of a certain size that you force the case thru to bring it back to a predetermined spec unless you're fortunate enough to have a rolling resizer. Find a die that works with your gun.

Chamber sizes seem to differ depending on the maker or designer of the chamber reamer. I've seen the specs on a few of the different reamers and the major difference is in the amount of freebore, or the transition area before the bullet wedges into the rifling. Design variations to aid in accuracy according to the different makers. I bought a couple 9mm barrels from Cart and noticed that certain shapes of bullets will not fit in the chambers whereas they work perfectly in the Colt barrels as well as other factory 9mm barrels. I had to sink the bullet a bit deeper so that they just kiss the rifling and they are accurate as all heck. Its trial and error with the 9x23 to find the combination of all the parts to fullfill youre needs.

The problem is with the 9x23 is that there isn't any standard specs. CP9x23S, 9x23 Winchester, 9mm Supercomp are all different cases that were made with different dimensions, internally and externally. After the lawsuits were finally settled none of the players took the move to standardize the 9x23 Chambers or Case sizes.

The bottom line is that if you want to shoot the 9x23 get a combo that works and stick wth it. I have 7 or 8 9x23's and I had to standarize each of the chambers to the size I thought was the best for me. If I shot the shells in the Barsto chambers and reloaded them, I couldn't shoot them in the Colt guns or the Springfields. I reamed all the chambers to the BarSto dimensions. I ahd to go thru 3 dies to find one the size I needed. Now everything functions great and I can shoot my brass in any of the guns, reload it and it will work again in any of the other guns.
 
Old 03-26-2004, 06:30 PM   #6
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 260
Clymer's take on the differences

Have to get an answer from RCBS on their view of the differences in the dies -

here is Clymer on differences in the reamers from which differences in the chambers follow - time was dies might be made with chambering reamers

FROM CLYMER WEBSITE:
Clymer 9x23 Win
base .3921
case mouth .382
free bore .358
pilot .3455
chamber length .9
free bore length .085
rim thickness .2
throat 2 degrees

Clymer 9x23 Nolin
base .3920
case mouth .382
free bore .358
pilot .3450
chamber length .9
free bore length .060
rim thickness .2
throat 2 degrees

As noted I expect tolerances to stack so as to make one or another of the dies work best for a given combination of brass chamber and load but also that same die would not be globally best.

I wonder where my 9x21 dies will fit other than between 9x19 and 9x23 in a numerical listing?
 
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